One Bit Shy wrote:
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsmtsm@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
news:0a4ace79-ff76-473d-976d-5b073cd7a025@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > On Feb 12, 10:27 pm, "One Bit Shy" <O...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> >> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in
> >>
messagenews:6659dcab-5eab-4788-a2e7-6522c9e759d1@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>
> >> > From [our] Stephen: "One theory
> >> > I've heard is that Connor is, in many ways, the opposite of Buffy &
> >> > Co. On that show, our teenagers often have to cope with adults
> >> > apparently being willfully stupid or blind, failing to understand
them
> >> > and their concerns, and generally being obtuse. Here it's Angel,
the
> >> > adult, who's our protagonist - and it's his turn to be baffled by
the
> >> > actions and feelings of his teenage son."
> >>
> >> I wonder how much we're supposed to empathize with both Angel and
Connor.
> >> We can certainly see how Angel is baffled by the teenager. But can
we
> >> perhaps perceive on the teenage level too? In other words, Angel,
the
> >> adult, still can be obtuse and non-understanding - making the
mistakes
> >> adults make. And it surely is adults that screw Connor up. Or to
put it
> >> yet another way, is Connor someone for teens to relate to and attract
> >> them
> >> to the show? I've wondered sometimes what they had in mind making
him
> >> such
> >> a major cast character. But the circumstances of his creation plus
next
> >> year's exploitation by Cordy dooms him to be the screwed up kid
headed
> >> for a
> >> bad end.
> >
> > The reason I can't see that kind of design is that in his earliest
> > episodes, Connor's an enigma. The show works hard to keep us in the
> > dark along with Angel - even when we're following Connor in ANW for
> > instance, we don't find out how thoroughly Holtz has shaped him until
> > almost the end of the episode. This is a character who starts out
> > from an alien position far removed from any young viewers, no matter
> > what issues they may have with their parents, and begins with an
> > entrenched desire to hurt our protagonist. So it seems pretty clear
> > to me that as far as We The Viewer are concerned, we're intended to
> > want to save him, not to identify with him.
>
> Admittedly I was thinking more of the decision to keep him as a major S4
> character than how he's used at the end of S3. And, even if they did
have
> something like that in mind, the story foundation couldn't accommodate
it.
> However, there is also this from Benediction.
>
> Fred: Wait a minute. Wow. Something here is pretty (looks up see Connor
> standing in front of her) hot.
>
> I don't think that's a line they'd use if they didn't think there was
> potential as a heartthrob.
Well, Kartheiser is indeed cute. Maybe they didn't quite realize how
much the story foundation would continue to limit that kind of
potential? Who knows? I also heard (secondhand on the NG) that it
was thought that the Cordelia/Connor relationship would draw in fans,
yet at the same time, everything about the way it's written/performed/
shot suggests that it's intended to creep the viewer the hell out.
So, who knows?
> > I mis-wrote, because that's what I was thinking of most with the
> > infectious joy. The alley scene is when it's just a thrill to watch.
> > The actors completely sell me that these characters have a connection
> > that can't be denied or destroyed, and is the most convincing of the
> > various teases that this could possibly end well. Holtz believes that
> > what he sees here has the potential to overcome everything that he's
> > quote-unquote-accomplished, unless he takes drastic action, and he's
> > probably right.
>
> I tend to think that Holtz wanted that bonding (why he pushed Connor
onto
> Angel to begin with) so as to make his revenge perfectly painful. But I
> don't know. That's one of the examples where I'm tantalized by Holtz's
> thinking. How much is plan? How much is improv? How much in control
was
> he? His plotting seemed to walk a thin line. Maybe he'd really lose
> Connor. Or maybe Connor would so antagonize Angel that he'd never find
that
> sweet spot for his revenge. Yet, at the same time, he seems to have
such a
> perfect handle on both Angel's and Connor's emotions that he might have
been
> in control all along.
Holtz seems quick on his feet. Think of "Lullaby;" nothing he finds
out keeps him from coming up with a new plan.
-AOQ
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