On Mon, 12 May 2008 18:14:09 -0500, "Ryan P."
<rpaque@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> Jim Gysin wrote:
>
> >> The bearing you follow to approach the island would change
depending
> >> on where your starting point is.
> >
> > But for the bearing to be the same coming *and* going, then either the
> > island has moved 180 degrees relative to the freighter or the
freighter
> > has moved 180 degrees relative to the island. Or each has move 90
> > degrees, or some other combination of movement that adds up to the
> > required 180 degrees. Because all other things being equal, if I
leave
> > an island and travel NW (305 degrees) to a stationary freighter, I
> > expect to travel SE to get back to the island again. And I would
assume
> > that heading NW *from* the freighter would take me even farther away
> > from the island, as opposed to back towards it.
> .
> I agree with you on that. In theory, one should be able to go out in
> a straight line, and come back on that same line safely.
That's what you'd think, but it's not what's been said. Sayid, for
example, wasn't told 305 minus 180. He was told 305. Weird.
> > And I obviously FUBAR'ed my math in my last reply. 180 degrees from
325
> > would be 145, not 035. Someone fire my grade school math teacher.
> .
> Must be a SE Wisconsin thing.. I didn't even notice! lol
> >
> >> Take your house, for instance. Say that you can only enter through
> >> your front door. Your front door may be at a bearing of 125 from
your
> >> place of work. On the other hand, it may be at a bearing of 150 from
> >> the grocery store. While you can approach your front door from the
> >> OUTSIDE from any compass point, you can only EXIT the front door from
> >> one point.
> >
> > So you're saying that the freighter is moving? Or do you believe that
> > the island is moving? Because if neither is moving, your analogy
> > doesn't apply, as no one has done the equivalent of traveling from the
> > workplace to the grocery store.
> .
> I assume that there is SOME movement of the freighter. I don't recall
> seeing it anchored (not that I've looked too hard), so there should be
> some natural drift of a few degrees one way or the other on a compass.
It would take a *lot* of drift to account for a 180 degree discrepancy!
> Of course, the closer they are to the island, the more pronounced the
> bearing change would be.
> >
> >> As far as cir***navigating the globe.... why would one need to do
> >> that? The worse case scenario is that one would have to
cir***navigate
> >> the island to get to the access point.
> >
> > But *if* the island is stationary and *if* the freighter is stationary
> > and *if* a course of 325 takes you *from* the island *to* the
freighter
> > and *if* you have to take a course of 305 to safely leave the
freighter,
> > then you are continuing to head *away from* the island when you leave
> > the freighter--again, assuming that the island and the freighter
haven't
> > moved relative to one another in the meantime.
> .
> See above. :) I could be completely wrong, of course. I make no
> guarantees!
> >
> >> If your front door is on the north side of the house, and you are
on
> >> the south side of the house, all you need to do is walk around the
house
> >> to get to the front door.
> >
> > But you've been told that it's not safe to walk around the house!
You've
> > been told that the only safe course is one that takes you *away from*
> > your house. Essentially, you would have to do a 360 loop, which is
why
> > I mentioned the cir***navigating business.
> .
> Reading my mind in the following sentance...
> >
> > The only alternative is that these courses are critical only *within*
> > the "snow globe" and that, once outside of it, you can turn around and
> > head back *into* the snow globe and head back the way you came.
> .
> I think that there is a certain amount of "territorial water"
> connected to the island which is inside the "snow globe."
I agree.
> We can assume
> that it doesn't extend indefinitely, or else nobody would ever be able
> to sail across the ocean without getting lost in a timewarp.
Agreed again.
> So, even if we don't know the extent of this snow globe, the MOST
> amount of sailing we would have to do "out of our way" would be to a
> known ****pping lane. Granted, you might sail 60 miles out of your way
> to get to the other side of the island, but it beats sailing 26,000
miles.
This would make sense *if* the "snow globe" was the reason for having to
follow the specific bearing in the first place, but we don't know that.
Heck, we don't even know for sure if there *is* a snow globe, and all of
this bearings business is making me think that, at best, there's a snow
globe *and* something else to contend with here.
> But
> > Sayid doesn't ask anything like that. At the very least, if I were
he,
> > I would have said, "Okay, so I have to take a course of 305 to safely
> > leave the freighter. But that takes me away from the island. So how
> > many miles do I have to go on that course before I can *turn around*
and
> > safely head back *to* the island?"
> .
> The only question I've ever seen anybody ask on this show that *I* was
> thinking should be asked was Locke when he asked what the smoke monster
> was. Characters NEVER ask the right questions... if they did, there
> wouldn't be a show, I suppose... lol
> >
True.
> >> Of course, you house isn't invisible, so you know exactly where the
> >> walls are to avoid them...
> >
> > Look at it this way. Say your front door is on the north side of your
> > house, and you're told that the only way you can safely approach or
> > leave your house is via the front door. So one day, you go out and
> > visit a friend who lives to the north of you. And when you're done
> > visiting with your friend, he tells you that the only safe route back
> > home is for you to walk north.
> >
> > What do you do?
> .
> Try to figure out how much whiskey he drank. :)
>
> But seriously, as I'm thinking about it, Michael's starting point was
> from the Others' side of the island. After this last episode, we see
> that the freighter appears to be somewhere off the coast of the Lostie's
> side of the island, judging by the direction of the helicopter buzzing
> the camp.
Based on how long it *should* have taken the chopper to reach the
freighter, I'm calculating the freighter to be 100 miles away from the
island, or thereabouts. At that distance, departing from one side of
the island or the other is not going to make much different
bearing-wise, and it sure as heck won't account for a 180 degree
variance!
> Perhaps the entry/exit point extends to both sides of the snow
> globe... like a straight line. You can enter or exit at both of these
> points. However, the side of the island you are leaving from (or
> approaching towards)would have a direct effect on what direction you
> need to travel.
Possible, but again, Gault didn't say "Use a bearing of either 305 or
(305-180)." He said 305, period.
> I'm a Milwaukee boy myself!
You're obviously someone of exceptional taste and refinement!
--
Jim Gysin
Waukesha, WI
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